2025-08-22 10:25
michaelni changed the topic of #ffmpeg-devel to: Welcome to the FFmpeg development channel | Questions about using FFmpeg or developing with libav* libs should be asked in #ffmpeg | This channel is publicly logged | FFmpeg 8.0 has been released! | Please read ffmpeg.org/developer.html#Code-of-conduct
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desmond-netint >
Color/camera question from a beginner. Are rgb values in bayer formats always linear?
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Lynne >
nope, usually they're not
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Lynne >
arri's cameras output in arri logc3/4, panasonic have v-log, DJI have dlog, red have log3g10, canon have clog3, apple have applelog, and sony have a whole bunch of log colorspaces
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Lynne >
they're all very very similar, with low values being linear, up until a point where they turn log
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Lynne >
I wish we could implement them, since currently you need custom code to linearize them
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Lynne >
libplacebo supports applying lookup tables (.icc and .cube), but its difficult to convert those curves (because of a lack of tools) into tables you can apply
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Lynne >
maybe haasn knows more
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Lynne >
desmond-netint: by the way, most of these cameras can record to h265 using
*these* colorspaces, so its not unique to bayer
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desmond-netint >
Lynne: thx for the info
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haasn >
Lynne: libplacebo also supports v-log and s-log fwiw
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haasn >
but without bayer support that probably doesn't mean a whole lot
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haasn >
cc desmond-netint
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haasn >
fwiw usually ungraded raw footage doesn't exist in any "colorspace" anyway so getting an approximately linear dump of the frame contents is about the best we can do, and what past users seemed happy with
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haasn >
in theory you would even treat these quasi-logarithmic curves as linear and effectively get some built-in automatic tone mapping that way
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JEEB >
yea you mostly then need to decide whether you want to interpret that linear stuff as SDR or HDR (and within which parameters)
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Lynne >
haasn: any way you see to add support for v-log, even if its only in vf_libplacebo?
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haasn >
Lynne: we could introduce negative enum values for non-H.273 trcs
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haasn >
but that's a can of worms I'd rather not touch
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Lynne >
what about values greater than 255?
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haasn >
for vf_libplacebo only, I was thinking about adding a way to override the frame metadata with :extra_opts
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haasn >
which would allow you to pass e.g. -vf libplacebo=extra_ops='src_trc=v-log'
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Lynne >
sure, that would work for now
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haasn >
cc kasper93 this is another use case for having frame overrides in pl_options
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kasper93 >
well, sure if you fell like it
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Lynne >
haasn: the libplacebo options interface does not support overriding any colorspace properties, it seems
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kasper93 >
I wanted to add HDR10 metadata injection in mpv itself. to be able to generate test patterns from scripts
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kasper93 >
having it in libplacebo interface works too, I'm not a big fan of splicing strings to configure things when there is an api tho ;p
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haasn >
Lynne: yeah, I feel like that would be a bit out of place in light of vf_setparams existing
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haasn >
and more importantly, the fact that libplacebo can have multiple inputs
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haasn >
ofc the same applies to :extra_opts
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haasn >
but at least that would be more generally useful as a future-proofing metric
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Lynne >
yeah, I'll just add AVCOL_TRC_V_LOG=256 and check that nowhere where it matters we use 8-bit values for trc
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BBB >
"Last we have FFMpeg AAC (lavf) whose spectrum is basically unrecognizable. There's almost no discernible pattern any longer and the artifacts make up pretty much the entire spectrum because - as iterations piled up - artifacts are the ones that got preserved leading to the averaging of the entire signal." ai ai ai?
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Lynne >
BBB: source?
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BBB >
(trigger warning: it re-encodes the encoding output 101 times)
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Lynne >
haasn: any chance of implementing a color temperature correction in libplacebo?
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Lynne >
its the last piece of the puzzle to fully process raw video
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Lynne >
(along with bayer, which I only implemented in vf_scale_vulkan to make you implement it in libplacebo)
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16:29
<
haasn >
Lynne: cct exists
16:29
<
Lynne >
software frames only
16:30
<
Lynne >
6k and 8k is too much for most CPUs, slice threading or not
16:32
<
haasn >
I guess you want the ability to set an exact kelvin value?
16:34
<
haasn >
Oh that one also still hard codes bt709
16:39
<
kepstin >
looks like that's a relative colour adjustment, not absolute, so i'm not sure setting a value in K would be meaningful?
16:41
<
kepstin >
it looks like a value of 0 doesn't actually mean "convert to 6500K", but rather "no change"?
16:44
<
Lynne >
haasn: yeah, that's right, could you also relax the 2500K limit down to ~1500K (candle light)
16:44
<
Lynne >
what's hardcoded to bt709?
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<
haasn >
Tbh I’d rather we add a field for the custom whitepoint to the color_space enum
16:45
<
haasn >
s/enum/struct/
16:45
<
haasn >
Or I guess we can already do that, via the mastering primaries?
16:46
<
haasn >
Actually maybe there is nothing to do here
16:46
<
haasn >
Just set the whitepoint of your metadata correctly
16:46
<
haasn >
And it should just work (tm)
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<
Lynne >
ffmpeg can't set whitepoint, involving lavfi is something I'd love to avoid, adding side data just for the whitepoint is cumbersome, and the setting is there already
16:53
<
kepstin >
iirc whitepoints are normally specified as x,y colour coordinates? mapping those to cct is a bit of annoying math since the colour temperature curve is a weird non-linear thing. Annoyingly, D65 is actually 6504K cct.
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<
kepstin >
that non-linearity also means that "5000K to 3500K" and "9300K to 7800K" are very different things, despite both being -1500K :/
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<
haasn >
Lynne: why avoid lavfi? are you an api user?
21:15
<
haasn >
just set the frame side data yourself
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<
BtbN >
That guy seems very confused. "sudo" didn't fix it on my "Win11 Home N"
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